Apple's Move to x86: More Questions Answered
by Anand Lal Shimpi on June 7, 2005 4:55 AM EST- Posted in
- Trade Shows
So, which Intel CPUs will Apple be using?
Steve Jobs stated that they'd be shipping Intel based Macs by June 2006, so let's consult the handy Intel roadmaps and see what will be available by June 2006.
On the desktop side, two new 65nm cores will be introduced in Q1 2006 - well before Apple's June 2006 deadline: the dual core Presler and the single core Cedar Mill processors.
We saw Presler running at last year's Fall IDF, albeit only at 2.0GHz. When Presler makes its debut early next year, it will be clocked at 2.8GHz at the low end and 3.4 - 3.6GHz at the high end. The chip will also feature a 2MB L2 cache per core and we're guessing that a number of architectural enhancements didn't make their way into Prescott. As is the case with the current Pentium D, Presler will not have Hyper Threading enabled by default, although the Extreme Edition based on Presler may have HT enabled.
Intel's Presler, most likely the first high end Powermac candidate for Apple next year.
We would expect Apple to use a combination of both cores, Cedar Mill for their entry level Powermacs, Presler for their high end SKUs and potentially even a HT enabled Extreme Edition for their highest end Powermac. Given the strong brand that Apple has created with the Powermac G5 name, we do wonder what they will call this next-generation of Intel based Powermacs; somehow, the Powermac P4 just doesn't sound right, not to mention that the name Pentium 4 has been left behind since the move to dual core.
With Intel's dual core processors, Apple can effectively offer the same TLP as their current dual processor G5s with only a single CPU socket in next year's Intel solutions. If you've ever looked at the cooling solutions required for Apple's 2.5GHz or 2.7GHz G5 systems, being able to cut that down by a half would definitely help lighten up and reduce the cost of producing/shipping their machines. One advantage that the G5 does currently have is that its die is extremely small, measuring only 66 mm2 compared to the 206 mm2 Pentium D die. The move to 65nm will help Intel, but the G5 definitely has a size advantage. However, with Intel's volumes, it is unlikely that the die size advantage will translate into any pricing advantage for the PowerPC chips over Intel's solutions for Apple.
The most excitement appears to be around Apple's ability to get their hands on the Pentium M next year - not to mention that in Q1 2006, Intel will begin shipping Yonah, their first dual core Pentium M processor. In our review of the PowerBook G4, we talked about the bulk of the unit and how it would be nice to get something smaller. Well, with the Pentium M, Apple will be able to produce a truly thin and truly light PowerBook without sacrificing performance.
But, let's not get caught up in the next year alone. Clearly, Apple is interested in the long haul, as you don't make this sort of a commitment without looking at the 5-, 10- and 15-year futures for your partner. Presler and Cedar Mill weren't the cores that won Apple over; it is Intel's Platform 2015 vision, the NetBurst successor and their ability to learn from their mistakes with the Pentium 4 that are what won Apple over. As many of you have pointed out, Apple may very well just skip over the NetBurst generation of desktop processors and initially begin the switch to Yonah on the mobile side - arguably where Apple needs a refresh the most. Then, in line with Intel's roadmap, introduce Intel's replacement architecture for NetBurst later in 2006 or by the middle of 2007.
Why not AMD? Much of Apple's success is due to marketing and branding, not necessarily technological leadership. That should sound a lot like Intel these days, whose processors essentially lag behind AMD in terms of technology, but outsell AMD by huge margins, thanks to strong marketing and branding. The Intel brand is much stronger than AMD's, and that is the sort of partner that Apple is interested in.
The ability to supply Apple's volumes isn't a huge deal, as many have pointed out. AMD could most definitely handle Apple's volumes. Intel's pricing to Apple is most likely far more attractive than anything AMD could put together, however, and when existing as a premium PC manufacturer is already quite difficult, any breaks on CPU pricing that you can get are definitely worth it.
So, why not support both AMD and Intel? Apple may in the future, although it is highly unlikely anytime soon - especially given whatever sort of pricing arrangement that Apple and Intel have worked out. Right now, Apple has no intentions of confusing their marketplace. Let the transition from PPC to x86 take place, and then worry about Apple supporting AMD. If Intel does indeed embrace an on-die memory controller and a Hyper Transport-like interface by 2007 in a cooler running architecture, the demand for Apple to support AMD may in fact diminish.
Intel needs a partner like Apple. For the longest time, Intel has been promising usage models and concept PCs that we all wanted, but would never surface. PC vendors focused on producing the cheapest system possible, while dealing with backwards compatibility and standards compliance with a huge install base - effectively, making change difficult. Look at how long it has taken us to transition away from the Parallel and Serial ports on PC motherboards or the move to SATA drives. With Apple, Intel finally has a partner that is willing to adapt to change at a much more rapid pace and one that can implement new technologies extremely quickly, thanks to a small, agile user base.
The Apple/Intel relationship will definitely change the dynamics of many business relationships spanning the entire PC industry. The question is no longer "if...", but rather "how...".
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drumt - Tuesday, June 7, 2005 - link
Predictions?Mine:
Because of the Intel chip transition:
...more games will run under the new Mac OS making the gaming platform of choice.
...Macs will be come affordable and more fans will arise.
...the faults of Windows will be obvious making a Mac OS the choice.
...Windows will buy Apple and merge making the Best OS the computing world has ever seen!
...Bill Gates will own the world!!
Yours?
Scott66 - Tuesday, June 7, 2005 - link
Two reasons apple wants to stop using powerpc. Can't deliver on promise to ship 3 GHz G5 with IBMCan't design G5 Powerbook with IBM PowerPC
Fricardo - Tuesday, June 7, 2005 - link
Tears for AMD.downtowncb - Tuesday, June 7, 2005 - link
On their G5 website, Apple is comparing the G5s of today to the Pentium chips of today. They are not saying that the G5 will trounce the Intel chip they will use in the future. So what if a current G5 can beat the current development kit? Development kits are frequently underpowered. The G5 machines that were used to develop Xbox 360 games, for example. The comparisons Apple is making today do not hold for the future.adamfilip - Tuesday, June 7, 2005 - link
Apple isnt saying that intel chips are faster. and there is no reason for apple to change its product page stating that the G5 is no longer fasterall they stated was that intel has a better performance per watt. not that it has better performance overall.
so if intel has 4 units of performance per wat and ibm has 2 units per watt. well then the intel part uses has as much energy to go just as fast.
not that its twice as fast
rivieracadman - Tuesday, June 7, 2005 - link
I don't know if it has really occured to anyone, or if it's just me, but has anyone considered that the reason Jobs choose Intel was because they can provide a platform where AMD can't. If this hardware is to remain Apple specific, then they will need what IBM provided them in the past; An entire platform. This goes for mobile, as well as desktop. The last personal Intel Machine I had was a Pentium MMX. I would love to run OSX, but not sure if I'm willing to buy Intel to do it. All this being said. I think Jobs should launch an all out x86 version of OSX, and slowly wiggle free of the hardware buisness. Their software is some of the best on the market, and at a fair price they could really build up a solid user base.MrEMan - Tuesday, June 7, 2005 - link
My guess is that Apple/Jobs doesn't want to release OS X for non-Apple hardware because then they would run into many of the same problems as Windows, that being loss of stability and greater risk of hacks and viruses/spyware etc, not to mention that they would probably lose the hardware side somewhere down the road (the reason I believe Jobs killed the Mac compatibles when Apple rehired him after his exit from Next).I know many don't like Microsoft, but I have to give them credit for making Windows work with so many different hardware and software combinations. The current Mac better be more stable considering that Apple controls both the OS and the hardware.
barnett25 - Tuesday, June 7, 2005 - link
If Apple made OSX standalone that you could install on any PC they would die. Everyone would pirate it (you don't even need to activate OSX), Apple's sales would be awfull, and stability would suck (MS has said before that most of the problems they have are due to device drivers). Every Mom and Pop computer shop would sell discount PCs with pirated OSX. I really don't see how you can think selling OSX for PCs is a good idea. Please explain it to me.edwardhchan - Tuesday, June 7, 2005 - link
#20:Becuase Apple would rather sell their own computers that exclusively run MacOS and Windows ... and they can get away with it. Imagine, all us Mac users who also play games won't need two machines anymore! There have been dual-boot macs in the past, but they were always quirky because they had a pc on a daughtercard. With an x86 OS X, one could conceivable use WINE to run windows apps inside OS X, or have the option to dual-boot into Longhorn (just make sure to have LOTS of disk space!)
Chadder007 - Tuesday, June 7, 2005 - link
I wonder if IBM told Apple that they won't have the production capacity to make much more PPC's since they will now be making the PowerPC alternatives for the next 3 Gaming Consoles....XBOX360/Revolution/PS3. ???They may have asked them to pay more for future processors since they would possibly have to build another factory just to handle the load...